Nike
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Post by Nike on Oct 26, 2005 11:42:43 GMT -5
Recently i find some strange looking screenshots from Croc 2. Here is the link: www.richpsx.com/croc2.htm You can see race on the woody platforms from "Up the waterfall", Croc under water and other things like this...
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Post by Forte Wily on Oct 27, 2005 10:31:02 GMT -5
Ah, I remember these screenshots. They're all from pre-release development versions of the game. Here's a bit of information about them; www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-1.jpg and www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-2.jpg - These images both show the boat-race in the Sailor Gobbo Village in its early form - it was a raft race, as you can see. I haven't got any idea what's up with that weird statue in 'croc2-1.jpg', though. www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-3.jpg - This is a bit of a strange one. Several magazines claimed that this screenshot was from a mini-game - however, this probably isn't the case. After all, in pre-release versions of Croc 2, the binoculars didn't exist, and Croc used a telescope instead - that's what we can see him looking through in this picture. What Croc's looking at (the ship and its captain should be familiar!) is more likely part of a pre-boss story sequence that would have been out of the player's control. www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-4.jpg - Croc 2's missing underwater level (of course ). Whether this was part of the Sailor Village (it probably was, given that it appears to be on a sunken pirate ship of some sort), or from Croc 2's missing village, I don't know. This stage was also featured in a US promotional trailer for the game (which was also published on a VHS tape given away with a British magazine in mid-1999). www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-5.jpg - To the best of my knowledge, this was the first screenshot of Croc 2 ever to be published in Europe. It shows Croc walking backwards, like he could in Croc: Legend of the Gobbos - an ability he unfortunately lacks in the final version of the game. (However, the Croc 1 control method could be enabled via the pause menu in the Windows 95/98 version of Croc 2.) www.richpsx.com/screens/croc2-6.jpg - This one is simply a picture taken from one of the jungle stages in the Sailor Village, but it's from a rather odd angle.
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Nike
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Post by Nike on Oct 27, 2005 11:29:08 GMT -5
Thanks for the answer. Very sadly, than all of this don`t been in final version. I think, the race on a rafts is more better, that race on boats, because gobbos has too modern convenience, like cars, planes, etc. But very similar, than all in Croc happened somwhere in 1200 - 1600 years, or earlier, and this is not bring feeling of the middle ages atmosphere...
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Post by Forte Wily on Oct 29, 2005 8:27:38 GMT -5
But very similar, than all in Croc happened somwhere in 1200 - 1600 years, or earlier, and this is not bring feeling of the middle ages atmosphere... Well, really, no date has ever been given for when the Croc series takes place. However, as far as I'm aware, it's most likely set in the present day - it's just that Croc, Baron Dante, the Gobbos, and everyone else, seem to be far away from human civilisations (and yet the Gobbos seem to know and mimic some groups of humans, in Croc 2. ;D).
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SoniCroc
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Post by SoniCroc on Oct 29, 2005 18:41:39 GMT -5
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Nike
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Post by Nike on Nov 1, 2005 13:21:42 GMT -5
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Nike
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Post by Nike on Nov 3, 2005 6:43:50 GMT -5
Well, really, no date has ever been given for when the Croc series takes place. However, as far as I'm aware, it's most likely set in the present day - it's just that Croc, Baron Dante, the Gobbos, and everyone else, seem to be far away from human civilisations (and yet the Gobbos seem to know and mimic some groups of humans, in Croc 2. ;D). Agreed. But only one little thing... In instruction booklet of first Croc wroten: "Who were the Gobbos? Examine ANCIENT paintings from the TIME of their civilisation..." Who knows, what happened with gobbos in Croc 2...
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Post by Forte Wily on Nov 3, 2005 13:02:03 GMT -5
But only one little thing... In instruction booklet of first Croc wroten: "Who were the Gobbos? Examine ANCIENT paintings from the TIME of their civilisation..." Who knows, what happened with gobbos in Croc 2... I think I mentioned this in another thread, but just in case it hasn't come up before, there is a small story behind that; The folks who made the Croc games were never happy with the tale included in the first game's manual which claimed that the Gobbos were from ancient times. The story in the manual for Croc 1 wasn't what they had wanted or intended for their characters - that part of the manual was actually written by one of the script-writers for the TV series 'The Simpsons'. Knowing this, the "ancient times" part can safely be disregarded.
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SparksTH
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Post by SparksTH on Nov 5, 2005 11:17:22 GMT -5
Sheesh, I had no idea they cut this much content from the final release. There's no excuse for dumping that water stage. Well, besides time constraints and stuff, but that's pretty inexcusable anyway.
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SoniCroc
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Post by SoniCroc on Jul 18, 2007 18:38:02 GMT -5
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Post by Forte Wily on Jul 19, 2007 17:15:43 GMT -5
I actually have this noted down in the main site's Random Facts section, but I'll quote it for convenience - it saves a long explanation. I learned this a long time ago. The folks at Argonaut didn't know why this was (hence the last bit of the above note), for what it's worth. It seems that it just is. As far as updating the site goes, as far as I'm aware, the only two pieces of Croc-related news between the last site update and now have been the announcement of Croc Mobile 2, and, more recently, Eidos purchasing Morpheme Mobile. As has probably become obvious by now, unfortunately, I don't really have the time to work on the site anymore, so when I do have the chance to sort it out, what I'll be doing is rejigging things so that it's just a site with some information and trivia, really. As an aside, I don't deal with screenshots of things which weren't used, so I'm afraid I won't be including such things whenever I get the time to do the "final" update.
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SparksTH
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Post by SparksTH on Jul 23, 2007 10:33:28 GMT -5
Regardless, it'd be really nice to have all these prototype differences documented somewhere (Though I suppose I could always write an article about it over at X-Cult or something). Anyway, nice finds, everyone- it's really unusual for games like this to have so much stuff left on the cutting room floor. It'd be awesome if someone could track down a copy of this proto.
EDIT: Come to think of it, I always thought the game ended rather abruptly, what with the final village only having 2 levels and all- this suggests most of this stuff was, indeed, removed due to time constraints. This game must've been one hell of a hack job.
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Post by Forte Wily on Jul 23, 2007 21:36:14 GMT -5
How come? Almost all video games go through changes in development. It's not a big deal at all, nor is it particularly interesting. It's not unusual at all, despite what some websites out there may claim. It happens with almost all games, and the reasons for it are almost always the same: Content that is removed is either unworkable, uninteresting, wasn't feasible to include before a tight deadline, or the underlying concepts and/or material just plain sucked. Sometimes it is a combination of some or all of these things. There really is no more to it than that. There were numerous Croc 2 prototypes during each stage of development. Most of the images out there originate from several different stages of the game's development. As I understand it, each was almost certainly destroyed once it had served its purpose, OR they wrote the current build onto a CD-RW once ready for testing (I can't quite recall which it was at this hour, but either way I'm quite sure that none survive). For what it's worth, they wouldn't leave the discs alone in the room with myself or the other visitors when I went to Argonaut's headquarters, for security reasons. The then-current PSX version (the one which was sent to Sony for approval the following day) which I played when I was there was near-identical to the one which was released at retail, save for a couple of bugs and a handful of typographical errors. There is nothing particularly awesome about buggy unfinished code. It always pales in comparison to the real and finished thing, in the end. I mean you no offence whatsoever, but in my humble opinion it could very easily be perceived as somewhat disrespectful to claim that the game must have been "one hell of a hack job" and act as though you have any idea what went into its production, when you almost certainly were not there and therefore did not see how things went, or actually take the time to talk about the production process with the folks who made it while they were still doing so, or witness the team hard at work on various portions of the game. I saw in person how the team worked their behinds off on the game - there was nothing hack-jobbish about it, let me tell you. Indeed, stuff was removed due to time-constraints, and that's what happens with almost all video games. However, as I came to understand it, the team got just about everything in there that they wanted to and were feasibly able to include given their deadlines (they themselves noted that they probably could have made several other games out of the stuff they wrote down which was not used - I saw the book, it was enormous). The ending, to that end, was not abrupt at all - it was seemingly as they wanted it to be.
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proog
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Post by proog on Aug 4, 2007 13:10:43 GMT -5
Wow, I had no idea about any of this... and I've never seen www.gameland.lv/Wallpapers/PS/Croc%202/croc2a1024x768.jpg before. Looks really stunning, actually. The enormous size of both Soveena and the dino really surprised me. And you sure know a lot of "insider" facts about Argonaut, Forte! Another thing, I've always admired the backgrounds (especially in the first game). There seems to be tall towers of some sort (take Forte's signature pic as an example). Anyone knows if there is a reason for this or not? And does anyone know a way to get those backgrounds on the pc? - Per
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SoniCroc
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Post by SoniCroc on Aug 6, 2007 18:03:44 GMT -5
I admire your respect, Forte Wily, as that is something that members of other forums seem to lack. However, when SparksTH said it must have been "one hell of a hack job," I think he just meant that it would have been very hard. (I'm not sure, though) As for the things that they cut out, I find those things interesting. In contrast, many changes in Sonic 2 Beta are very boring, such as the color of a section of a wall changing slightly, or some unknown box. The changes in Croc 2 seem to be fairly major. I guess the thing that interests me the most is that cowboy village, as an entire world would hold lots of secrets. However, none of the above pictures show any pictures of it, strangely.
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